Opinions on Generaloberst Hermann Hoth
Printed From: Panzerace.net: Michael Wittmann
Category: The Others
Forum Name: Oberkommando der Wehrmacht
Forum Discription: For discussion on the Wehrmacht and other Axis armies/formations
URL: http://www.panzerace.net/pz-forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=908
Printed Date: 10 September 2010 at 16:25
Topic: Opinions on Generaloberst Hermann Hoth
Posted By: leibstandarte
Subject: Opinions on Generaloberst Hermann Hoth
Date Posted: 14 July 2007 at 12:25
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I was wondering, what are everyone's opinions on Generaloberst Hermann Hoth? He was popular with his troops, which gave him nickname ''Papa''. Hero of Vyazma-Bryansk pocket, where forces under his command captured hundreds of thousands of Soviet troops. Managed to get some 30 km close to Stalingrad Kessel with his reinforced 4.Panzerarmee. Later during Unternehmen Zitadelle he was in command of the greatest panzer formation ever assembled, and was in a position to achieve a victory at Prokhorovka if Hitler had not intervened and stopped the offensive altogether. One of the blamed for the outcome at Kursk and was relieved of command. Later he was in command of defense of Harz Mountains in Northern Germany and imprisoned after the war. He was released in 1954. Opinions please. ------------- In battle he was my comrade, during meal time my worst enemy. Now he's upseting stomaches in heaven. RIP Ian |
Replies:
Posted By: Panther44
Date Posted: 14 July 2007 at 16:58
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Didn't know that much about him, but from what you say and what the 'net' says he sounds like he knew his business and took care of his troops. Nothing more important to the men under his command then that.
I think one of the more notable things I read on Hoth was that he managed to hold off three Russian Armies with a weakened
Korps that allowed the 1st Panzer Army to escape the Caucasus.
I read that he was sentenced to 12 years imprisonment, of which he served six, for war crimes. Does anyone know the charges? ------------- "Ten tanks attacking over open ground posed no big problem for a well sited Panther." Horst Zobel, Commander 1st Battalion Panzer Regiment Muncheberg |
Posted By: HvM
Date Posted: 15 July 2007 at 01:07
Here are some photographs of Generaloberst Hoth.   K ------------- Tumbleweed alert! - Papa Wehr - |
Posted By: HvM
Date Posted: 15 July 2007 at 01:10
   K ------------- Tumbleweed alert! - Papa Wehr - |
Posted By: HvM
Date Posted: 15 July 2007 at 01:20
   K ------------- Tumbleweed alert! - Papa Wehr - |
Posted By: HvM
Date Posted: 15 July 2007 at 01:27
   K ------------- Tumbleweed alert! - Papa Wehr - |
Posted By: leibstandarte
Date Posted: 15 July 2007 at 03:54
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@Panther44 Hoth was accused of the following:
------------- In battle he was my comrade, during meal time my worst enemy. Now he's upseting stomaches in heaven. RIP Ian |
Posted By: HvM
Date Posted: 15 July 2007 at 14:16
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Who charged Hoth? The Soviets? If that was the case, then it was probably a mock trial. K ------------- Tumbleweed alert! - Papa Wehr - |
Posted By: leibstandarte
Date Posted: 15 July 2007 at 14:53
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@HvM Hoth was charged, found guilty and sentenced in front of US tribunal. ------------- In battle he was my comrade, during meal time my worst enemy. Now he's upseting stomaches in heaven. RIP Ian |
Posted By: HvM
Date Posted: 15 July 2007 at 14:57
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The Soviets could have pressed for the charges though, as was the case
was the Erich von Manstein trial of 1949, which was motivated by a
desire on the part of the British Attle government to appease the
Soviets, adding on that the charges came from the Soviets. Basil Liddel
Hart and even Winston Churchill gave money for Manstein's defense, and
his defense lawyer was Jewish. I'm not saying Manstein was innocent and
a saint, there are dark events in his record according to recently
found information, but this places Hoth's and other German General's
trials in a political context, in which the trials were not likely to
be objective, or conducted with false charges. K ------------- Tumbleweed alert! - Papa Wehr - |
Posted By: Papa Wehr
Date Posted: 15 July 2007 at 16:48
http://www.ess.uwe.ac.uk/WCC/ghctrial1.htm#THE%20GERMAN%20HIGH%20COMMAND%20TRIAL - http://www.ess.uwe.ac.uk/WCC/ghctrial1.htm#THE%20GERMAN%20HIGH%20COMMAND%20TRIAL
 ------------- http://gingerwomble.pictiger.com/images/13578200/"> 
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Posted By: Tiger_S04
Date Posted: 15 July 2007 at 18:16
| I think we could have a decent debate here - but if you could HvM please post any images within one post. |
Posted By: Papa Wehr
Date Posted: 15 July 2007 at 18:20
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HvM
Reducing the size of your sig. might unclutter things also!
 ------------- http://gingerwomble.pictiger.com/images/13578200/">
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Posted By: HvM
Date Posted: 16 July 2007 at 05:34
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Thanks for the link Wehr, but unfortunately it does not contain the
minutes of the trial in which his allegded guilt is proven or
mis-proven in the eyes of different people. Here is the main charge - On The evidence showed, however, that even after he had
acquired knowledge of the activities of the SD within his area of command, his own
army police, over whom he had command authority, turned over civilian prisoners
and Jews to the SD as a regular practice right up to the time when he
relinquished his command. The evidence showed that the accused Reinhardt knew
as early as September, 1941, that the SD was operating within his area of
command. It also showed that not only did his army know about the activities of
the SD, but also actively co-operated with it in sending suspects of all kinds,
including civilian men, women and children. Thousands were in this way sent to While of course Hoth's alledged participation with the activities of
the Einsatzgruppen were criminal, on the part of the execution of
communists, it would be interesting if Red Army Commanders were brought
to trial for the execution of Nazis in Gemrany in 1945! K ------------- Tumbleweed alert! - Papa Wehr - |
Posted By: Panther44
Date Posted: 16 July 2007 at 23:09
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This trial had to have been at the request of the Soviets, why not just hand Hoth over to them? I mean it appears that everything Hoth is accused of happened in the east. Did Hoth spend any of the war years in the west? ------------- "Ten tanks attacking over open ground posed no big problem for a well sited Panther." Horst Zobel, Commander 1st Battalion Panzer Regiment Muncheberg |
Posted By: HvM
Date Posted: 18 August 2007 at 11:35
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Did Hoth spend any of the war years in the west? Yes, in the French campaign in 1940. K ------------- Tumbleweed alert! - Papa Wehr - |
Posted By: Langemarck27
Date Posted: 27 January 2008 at 16:52
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A late reply from Flanders on this one.
In my opinion Hoth should always be considered one of the great German commanders of WWII. With a bit of luck and some coöperation from HQ, he could well have made the difference at Stalingrad when the 6th Army was trapped in the Kessel...
I am proud to have his autographed Hoffmann card in my collection!
 ------------- Each Soldier's Grave is occupied Territory!! |
Posted By: panzerivan
Date Posted: 24 March 2008 at 09:40
| A very good fieldmarshall and certainly no warcriminal.He certainly did not order any warcrimes to be committed.The charges against were very weak. |
Posted By: panzerivan
Date Posted: 24 March 2008 at 10:17
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Some more detail on his dismissal. One of those competent fieldmarshalls and generals that were dismissed becuse of retreating even if it was necessary.
During November 1943, strong forces of the Russian 1st Ukranian Front, attacked the 4th Panzer Army to the west of Kiev. Hoth was forced to withdraw, as his Panzer Army was torn into three widely separated groups by the Russian attacks. Despite the fact that the situation was restored in mid November, Hoth was relieved of his command and sent on leave. In December 1943, he was dismissed entirely and spent the remainder of the war in retirement.
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Posted By: Jack O'Brien
Date Posted: 19 October 2009 at 06:51
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Hoth certainly looks the part of "German officer". He sounds like an excellent commander. As for Nuremburg everyone knows that was a joke because the Germans were the only ones on trial. Why weren't the allied bomber command put on trial for murdering huge numbers of civilians. Where do you draw the line between liberation and devastation? Ie the Allied idea of liberating French cities eg Caen was to blow them off the map.
Hoth has always been one of my favourites... PS and for star wars fans the fact his name is Hoth only makes him all the more awesome lol ------------- "In the absence of orders, find something and kill it" Erwin Rommel |
Posted By: Pzkpfw-e
Date Posted: 22 October 2009 at 11:43
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Originally posted by Jack O'Brien
Some contentious views there!
. As for Nuremburg everyone knows that was a joke because the Germans were the only ones on trial. Why weren't the allied bomber command put on trial for murdering huge numbers of civilians. Where do you draw the line between liberation and devastation? Ie the Allied idea of liberating French cities eg Caen was to blow them off the map. The purpose of the Nurenburg Trials was to bring the Nazis to justice. If anything, many escaped that & not just by scuttling off to South America!
The concentration camp guards, for one group, largely escaped their just deserts.
There was indeed a large measure of "Victors' Justice" involved, little was done to bring those held responsible for the Biscari massacre to justice and taking that a generation further, the activities of Lt Calley's troops at Mai Lai shows that clearly. 109 civilians murdered, some of who were raped & mutilated. 30 soldiers tried, only one convicted who then was released after 5 months.
------------- Remember you are an Englishman and thus have won the lottery of life 
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Posted By: Jack O'Brien
Date Posted: 23 October 2009 at 00:41
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For example, to claim that the entire Waffen SS is a criminal organisation, and yet the Red Army is a heroic force of liberation is just so rediculous it defies description. If they were hanging war criminals then the entire British and American bomber commands should have been executed. ------------- "In the absence of orders, find something and kill it" Erwin Rommel |
Posted By: Pzkpfw-e
Date Posted: 23 October 2009 at 12:44
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"is just so rediculous it defies description"
Likewise your comment-
"If they were hanging war criminals then the entire British and American bomber commands should have been executed. "
------------- Remember you are an Englishman and thus have won the lottery of life
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Posted By: leibstandarte
Date Posted: 23 October 2009 at 13:53
Depends how high the command. The lower echelons were just obeying orders. ------------- In battle he was my comrade, during meal time my worst enemy. Now he's upseting stomaches in heaven. RIP Ian |
Posted By: Jack O'Brien
Date Posted: 25 October 2009 at 22:33
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Oh so if the Germans say they're just following orders, that's not good enough, but it's ok if the allies say that? if the allies can widely condemn every member of the Waffen SS as criminals regardless of their actions, then the same should be said for the Red army and allied bomber command, both guilty of horrendous war crimes ------------- "In the absence of orders, find something and kill it" Erwin Rommel |
Posted By: Sepp Dietrich
Date Posted: 27 October 2009 at 07:06
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Yes but the difference is, they won.
------------- http://s200.photobucket.com/albums/aa96/ssseppdietrichss/?action=view¤t=sepp.gif"> 
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